Difference between revisions of "CA Lorraine"
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== Description == | == Description == | ||
<!-- ''In the description, the first part should be about the history of the creation and combat usage of the vehicle, as well as its key features. In the second part, tell the reader about the ground vehicle in the game. Insert a screenshot of the vehicle, so that if the novice player does not remember the vehicle by name, he will immediately understand what kind of vehicle the article is talking about.'' --> | <!-- ''In the description, the first part should be about the history of the creation and combat usage of the vehicle, as well as its key features. In the second part, tell the reader about the ground vehicle in the game. Insert a screenshot of the vehicle, so that if the novice player does not remember the vehicle by name, he will immediately understand what kind of vehicle the article is talking about.'' --> | ||
| − | The ''' | + | The '''Canon d'Assaut Lorraine de 100 mm''' is a French prototype tank destroyer based on the [[AMX M4|AMX M4 medium tank]] project's chassis. Following World War II, the French Army launched several programs to replace their antiquated tanks. The Lorraine company was charged with developing a light tank destroyer. The Canon d'Assaut Lorraine used Veil-Picard pneumatic tires instead of regular road wheels, which reduced the vehicle's ground pressure. Another advantage of the tires is that even if the tracks are destroyed, the vehicle can continue to operate. The prototype was started in 1950 but did not finish until 1952. The project was cancelled in 1953. The expertise gained by developing the Canon d'Assaut Lorraine would eventually serve as the foundation for other Lorraine initiatives. |
| − | + | Introduced in [[Update 1.75 "La Résistance"]], the Canon d'Assaut Lorraine de 100 mm is a versatile tank destroyer that may be deployed in a variety of ways, although it will always rely on its speed. In terms of maximum speed, cross-country speed, turn time, neutral steering, and reverse speed, this tank destroyer is among the most agile in its class. It should not, however, be utilized as an assault tank leading the attack against the enemy. As there is no turret, players should avoid close-up combat with adversaries. Use it mostly to ambush foes by flanking them early in battles. Since the vehicle has incredibly weak armour overall, you should always reposition after firing. | |
== General info == | == General info == | ||
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{{main|SA47 L/58 (100 mm)}} | {{main|SA47 L/58 (100 mm)}} | ||
| − | This gun platform uses the usual French rank IV 100 mm SA47 L/58 cannon with a twist: it has no autoloader mechanism, hence making reload time | + | This gun platform uses the usual French rank IV 100 mm SA47 L/58 cannon with a twist: it has no autoloader mechanism, hence making reload time twice as long. However, at its battle rating, the gun packs an awesome 300 mm of penetration that ensures it can punch well above its own rank. The large shell calibre also means it can create quite a lot of fragments inside a tank, making the lack of explosive filler not so bad, as long as you land a good hit. |
| − | Keep that in mind as your foes get closer and closer to you: these precious | + | Keep that in mind as your foes get closer and closer to you: these precious 11 seconds of reload time are the perfect time to intent a frontal attack, even more so since you don't have automatic firepower of any form. Always have a backup plan, in case your single shot doesn't fully disable your target. |
{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" width="100%" | {| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center" width="100%" | ||
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! ''Arcade'' | ! ''Arcade'' | ||
| − | | rowspan="2" | 40 || rowspan="2" | -6°/+16° || rowspan="2" | ±9° || rowspan="2" | N/A || 5.3 || 7.3 || 8.9 || 9.8 || 10.4 || rowspan="2" | | + | | rowspan="2" | 40 || rowspan="2" | -6°/+16° || rowspan="2" | ±9° || rowspan="2" | N/A || 5.3 || 7.3 || 8.9 || 9.8 || 10.4 || rowspan="2" | 11.18 || rowspan="2" | 9.89 || rowspan="2" | 9.12 || rowspan="2" | 8.60 |
|- | |- | ||
! ''Realistic'' | ! ''Realistic'' | ||
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==== Ammunition ==== | ==== Ammunition ==== | ||
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| − | | 100 mm Obus de rupture | ||
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==== [[Ammo racks]] ==== | ==== [[Ammo racks]] ==== | ||
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| − | Note: | + | '''Note''': |
| − | Shells are modeled individually and disappear after having been shot or loaded. | + | * Shells are modeled individually and disappear after having been shot or loaded. |
== Usage in battles == | == Usage in battles == | ||
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'''When in urban combat:''' | '''When in urban combat:''' | ||
| − | The Lorraine has a big disadvantage when it comes to urban combat, it is turretless, meaning the tank will have to turn in order to aim at a certain place. This also makes crossing corners harder as the lack of turret reduces where your gun will be aiming as well as making an side firing angle (angle between your gun and your hull) narrower, forcing you to push almost frontally instead of doing sidescrapping. The mobility of the CA Lorraine makes it formidable when it comes to flanking as it is able to "Hit N' Run" and destroy or incapacitate enemies with relative speed. Be aware of your reload rate as you do not have autoloader (compared to [[Lorraine 40t]] which uses the same gun, the CA Lorraine reloads in | + | The Lorraine has a big disadvantage when it comes to urban combat, it is turretless, meaning the tank will have to turn in order to aim at a certain place. This also makes crossing corners harder as the lack of turret reduces where your gun will be aiming as well as making an side firing angle (angle between your gun and your hull) narrower, forcing you to push almost frontally instead of doing sidescrapping. The mobility of the CA Lorraine makes it formidable when it comes to flanking as it is able to "Hit N' Run" and destroy or incapacitate enemies with relative speed. Be aware of your reload rate as you do not have autoloader (compared to [[Lorraine 40t]] which uses the same gun, the CA Lorraine reloads in 11.1s stock without upgrades and Lorraine 40t in 4.0s regardless the crew or upgrades), this makes a huge disadvantage as you will be vulnerable after each shot, make each shot count. Aim for gunner, cannon breech or ammunition to disable and destroy tanks as an error will cost your life. Having only 50 mm of frontal armour makes the Lorraine only capable of withstanding some SPAA fire ([[Wirbelwind]], [[M42]], etc) but will be penetrated by all tank guns at its BR and even SPAA at point blank range. |
'''When in rural combat:''' | '''When in rural combat:''' | ||
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;Skins | ;Skins | ||
| − | * [https://live.warthunder.com/feed/camouflages/? | + | * [https://live.warthunder.com/feed/camouflages/?vehicle=fr_lorraine_100 Skins and camouflages for the {{PAGENAME}} from live.warthunder.com.] |
;Videos | ;Videos | ||
| − | {{Youtube-gallery|wSIXMQ0Gln4|'''The | + | {{Youtube-gallery|wSIXMQ0Gln4|'''The CA Lorraine, French, Tier-4, Tank Destroyer''' - ''Angry Nerd Gaming''|Gv-Fm4s2iwM|'''CA Lorraine - Fun, Fast 'n Furious''' - ''Napalmratte''}} |
== See also == | == See also == | ||
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;Vehicles equipped with the same chassis | ;Vehicles equipped with the same chassis | ||
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* [[Lorraine 155 Mle.50]] | * [[Lorraine 155 Mle.50]] | ||
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;Other vehicles of similar configuration and role | ;Other vehicles of similar configuration and role | ||
Latest revision as of 10:33, 22 October 2023
Contents
Description
The Canon d'Assaut Lorraine de 100 mm is a French prototype tank destroyer based on the AMX M4 medium tank project's chassis. Following World War II, the French Army launched several programs to replace their antiquated tanks. The Lorraine company was charged with developing a light tank destroyer. The Canon d'Assaut Lorraine used Veil-Picard pneumatic tires instead of regular road wheels, which reduced the vehicle's ground pressure. Another advantage of the tires is that even if the tracks are destroyed, the vehicle can continue to operate. The prototype was started in 1950 but did not finish until 1952. The project was cancelled in 1953. The expertise gained by developing the Canon d'Assaut Lorraine would eventually serve as the foundation for other Lorraine initiatives.
Introduced in Update 1.75 "La Résistance", the Canon d'Assaut Lorraine de 100 mm is a versatile tank destroyer that may be deployed in a variety of ways, although it will always rely on its speed. In terms of maximum speed, cross-country speed, turn time, neutral steering, and reverse speed, this tank destroyer is among the most agile in its class. It should not, however, be utilized as an assault tank leading the attack against the enemy. As there is no turret, players should avoid close-up combat with adversaries. Use it mostly to ambush foes by flanking them early in battles. Since the vehicle has incredibly weak armour overall, you should always reposition after firing.
General info
Survivability and armour
Armour type:
- Rolled homogeneous armour (casemate, cupola)
- Cast homogeneous armour (gun mantlet)
- Wheel (tires)
| Armour | Front | Sides | Rear | Roof |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Hull | 50 mm (54°) Front glacis 35 mm (61°) Lower glacis 60-150 (0-88°) + 35-60 mm (2-88°) Gun mantlet |
30 mm (15°) Top 30 mm Bottom |
25 mm (23°) Upper glacis 25 mm (54°) Lower glacis |
20 mm Front 20 mm (7°) Rear 8 mm (7°) Radiator and engine vents |
| Cupola | 50 mm (spherical) | 20 mm | ||
Notes:
- Suspension wheels, tracks and torsion bars are 20 mm thick.
Its sloped, medium thickness frontal armour will not protect you from anything bigger than SPAA shots (some may even get through in close quarters) but it is certainly sufficient for what it is designed to do: protecting from stray bullets in long range engagements. Side and top armour are also quite weak, so don't expect to survive any kind of surprise coming from side or top. Still, this tank has 5 crew members, which can often save it from a quick destruction.
Mobility
| Game Mode | Max Speed (km/h) | Weight (tons) | Engine power (horsepower) | Power-to-weight ratio (hp/ton) | |||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Forward | Reverse | Stock | Upgraded | Stock | Upgraded | ||
| Arcade | 68 | 18 | 25 | 973 | 1,307 | 38.92 | 52.28 |
| Realistic | 63 | 17 | 606 | 685 | 24.24 | 27.4 | |
If anyone thought the Lorraine 40t was a sprinter, this is even better. The CA Lorraine is fast. Not only in forward motion is it fast, it can reverse at a decent, constant, -16 km/h and it has ability to neutral steer, these enable fast reaction to quickly changing battlefield odds such as flanking manoeuvres or enemy breakthrough. An experienced player can take clear advantage over its foes by achieving good placement and this tank is the perfect tool for this task.
Modifications and economy
| Mobility | Protection | Firepower | ||||||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
|
|
Armaments
Main armament
This gun platform uses the usual French rank IV 100 mm SA47 L/58 cannon with a twist: it has no autoloader mechanism, hence making reload time twice as long. However, at its battle rating, the gun packs an awesome 300 mm of penetration that ensures it can punch well above its own rank. The large shell calibre also means it can create quite a lot of fragments inside a tank, making the lack of explosive filler not so bad, as long as you land a good hit.
Keep that in mind as your foes get closer and closer to you: these precious 11 seconds of reload time are the perfect time to intent a frontal attack, even more so since you don't have automatic firepower of any form. Always have a backup plan, in case your single shot doesn't fully disable your target.
| 100 mm SA47 L/58 | Turret rotation speed (°/s) | Reloading rate (seconds) | |||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Mode | Capacity | Vertical | Horizontal | Stabilizer | Stock | Upgraded | Full | Expert | Aced | Stock | Full | Expert | Aced |
| Arcade | 40 | -6°/+16° | ±9° | N/A | 5.3 | 7.3 | 8.9 | 9.8 | 10.4 | 11.18 | 9.89 | 9.12 | 8.60 |
| Realistic | 3.6 | 4.2 | 5.1 | 5.6 | 6.0 | ||||||||
Ammunition
| Penetration statistics | |||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Ammunition | Type of warhead |
Penetration @ 0° Angle of Attack (mm) | |||||
| 10 m | 100 m | 500 m | 1,000 m | 1,500 m | 2,000 m | ||
| Obus de rupture | APCBC | 273 | 270 | 257 | 242 | 228 | 215 |
| Obus explosif | HE | 30 | 30 | 28 | 26 | 24 | 22 |
| Shell details | ||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Ammunition | Type of warhead |
Velocity (m/s) |
Projectile mass (kg) |
Fuse delay (m) |
Fuse sensitivity (mm) |
Explosive mass (TNT equivalent) (kg) |
Ricochet | |||||
| 0% | 50% | 100% | ||||||||||
| Obus de rupture | APCBC | 1,000 | 15 | - | - | - | 48° | 63° | 71° | |||
| Obus explosif | HE | 1,000 | 14.8 | 0.2 | 0.1 | 1.4 | 79° | 80° | 81° | |||
Ammo racks
| Full ammo |
1st rack empty |
2nd rack empty |
3rd rack empty |
4th rack empty |
Visual discrepancy |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 40 | 31 (+9) | 21 (+19) | 11 (+29) | 1 (+39) | No |
Note:
- Shells are modeled individually and disappear after having been shot or loaded.
Usage in battles
The CA Lorraine can be used in different ways, but in all cases it will be relying on its speed. The CA Lorraine is one of the most agile tanks at its battle rating in terms of max speed, cross country speed, turn time, neutral steering and reverse. The CA Lorraine should not be used as an assault tank (often confused with the AMX-50 Foch). Use your speed as your main advantage.
When in urban combat:
The Lorraine has a big disadvantage when it comes to urban combat, it is turretless, meaning the tank will have to turn in order to aim at a certain place. This also makes crossing corners harder as the lack of turret reduces where your gun will be aiming as well as making an side firing angle (angle between your gun and your hull) narrower, forcing you to push almost frontally instead of doing sidescrapping. The mobility of the CA Lorraine makes it formidable when it comes to flanking as it is able to "Hit N' Run" and destroy or incapacitate enemies with relative speed. Be aware of your reload rate as you do not have autoloader (compared to Lorraine 40t which uses the same gun, the CA Lorraine reloads in 11.1s stock without upgrades and Lorraine 40t in 4.0s regardless the crew or upgrades), this makes a huge disadvantage as you will be vulnerable after each shot, make each shot count. Aim for gunner, cannon breech or ammunition to disable and destroy tanks as an error will cost your life. Having only 50 mm of frontal armour makes the Lorraine only capable of withstanding some SPAA fire (Wirbelwind, M42, etc) but will be penetrated by all tank guns at its BR and even SPAA at point blank range.
When in rural combat:
The Lorraine is a pretty decent sniper at its BR but this is by far one of the best combat roles the Lorraine can have. The 6x sight and the high muzzle velocity will make sniping easier than with other tanks at its BR. It should be noted that the CA Lorraine will not be able to withstand many frontal attacks even at range (PzGr 39 fired from KwK36, 42, 43 and 48 will penetrate the upper frontal plate with ease). Always stay on the move when possible. Fire and move. This is to make each attack unpredictable as people are prompt of revenge killing you with a tank or with an aircraft, always stay aware of your surroundings and stay away from suspicious locations enemies can look forward to detect and engage you.
Pros and cons
Pros:
- Good firepower, uses the same gun as AMX-50-100 and Lorraine 40t
- Very good penetration, definitely usable in uptiered games
- Exceptionally fast reverse speed
- Fairly low profile
- Capable of neutral steering
- Strong gun mantlet may bounce shots
- Fast with very good manoeuvrability
Cons:
- Weak armour all around
- Engines and fuel tanks only have 8mm armour, very vulnerable from above
- Reload rate is not impressive
- Poor gun depression (-6)
- No HE filler in AP shots means precision is necessary
- No coaxial MG
- Low gun placement
- Somewhat weak optic zoom
- Large ammo racks on both sides of the hull
History
Design
In the late 1940s, the French Army was looking to replace the medium tanks Panther and ARL 44 that were becoming obsolete with a new 50t medium tank. Other concepts were explored in parallel to the 50t medium tank: a 25t light tank and a 25t light tank destroyer. The French company Lorraine was tasked with the tank destroyer bid and proposed the Canon d'Assaut Lorraine. Clearly inspired from the layout of the Jagdpanzer IV and the Jagdpanther, the CA Lorraine was to assume the same support role on the battlefield along light and medium tanks.
Development
A 100 mm SA 47 L/58 gun was chosen to equip on the tank and the armour was kept to a mimimum to save weight and increase mobility. The vehicle featured pneumatic tires in place of road wheels. The upsides of such tires were the possibility to still move the tank destroyer when detracked, a weight reduction and thus a reduced ground pressure and an increased top speed. A prototype was built between 1950 and 1952 but the project was terminated in 1953. The tank destroyer weighed 25 tons, carried 40 shells and could reach 60 km/h. With the experience from the Korean war, the concept of dedicated tank destroyers was gradually abandoned in NATO armies to focus on armoured divisions composed uniquely of main battle tanks.
Combat usage
The CA Lorraine never saw either service or combat action with the French Army. Its chassis and many other parts were later reused in the development of the Lorraine 40t as well as in other projects.
Media
- Skins
- Videos
See also
- Vehicles equipped with the same chassis
- Other vehicles of similar configuration and role
External links
| Lorraine | |
|---|---|
| Tanks | |
| Medium tanks | Lorraine 40t |
| Tank destroyers | Lorraine 37L · CA Lorraine · Lorraine 155 Mle.50 |
| France tank destroyers | |
|---|---|
| Lorraine 40t derivatives | CA Lorraine · Lorraine 155 Mle.50 |
| ATGM | MEPHISTO · AMX-10M |
| Other | AMR.35 ZT3 · Lorraine 37L · SAu 40 · ARL-44 · ELC bis · AMX-50 Foch · AuF1 |
| USA | ▄M10 GMC · ▄M36B2 |
